Bard or Rogue/Wizard - which is better?

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I am trying to decide whether to take a Bard, or a Rogue/Wizard multiclass in my next party

His main role would be as a support spellcaster for the party, as well as the party rogue. So he would need good intelligence in order to get the necessary skills for a rogue. I figure that by having this guy with a number of support spells like knock I could also get away with spending to many skills points in Pick Locks, and a Cleric could cast Find Traps, so I no longer need Search.
I know that a Bard is essentially a rogue/wizard (jack-of-all-trades) character, but I have never been too fond of Bards, and would like to know if they provide any advantage over taking a multiclass rogue/wizard.

 

Make a Bard / Sorcerer. That multi is plain AWESOME. I am using it as one of my chars for my HoF game and it rocks. You just have to be careful about the spell selection.

 

How does a Bard/Sorcerer work, and what makes it awesome?
Do you have more sorcerer levels, or is it an even split?

 

Instead of a bard a rogue sorcerer has better spell options and of course the evasion and other rogue feats/skills. All of this means no songs. If you don't like songs then so what.

A bard/sorcerer would be awsome because all spells would be cast on the fly and what you can't get as a bard you can get as a sorcer and vice versa. Also if you really love a certain spell at a specific spell level you can pick if for both classes and thus have it lots.

A sorcerer would also have access to lots of other skills from the bard side.

The best thing about it is that the spells for sorcerer and bard both need Charisma, so if you have a high charisma you will get bonus spells twice, that is for each class.

Just thinking about it makes me want one...

Cheers

 

Bard/sorcerer does sound pretty cool.

If I was to go with this multiclass, what thief skills would I need? I mean, do I really need to put points in open locks if I have a knock spell?

In what way

 

Bard sorcerer are way cool! But realistically, I did not find that more than about 2 or three levels of Rogue are really useful. You don't get xp for traps and locks. Half the time just set them off, as at level 3 Rogue you will evade the effect often. Locks if you can't then go Knock or got Fighter "knock" there are not many locks that you need to get through and there are no doors that are essential to the game that can be picked anyway. If you like pickpocket, bards can. Hide? Anyone can. The only really unique skill is Sneak attack. I never really used it since my rogues were archers. Seriously go Bard with three levels of rogue. (As an aside or go monk with 1 level of Rogue.)

Clear as mud?

I think what Modjahed means about spells is that If you get a Level 1 spell pick in Sorcerer you could choose Magic Missile. When you get a level 1 spell pick for the Bard, you will not be able to pick Magic Missile but you could pick Chromatic Orb.

This means that you can either repick and have double the spell slots for that favourite spell, (not very useful) or you could branch out and pick a different spell and thus "have more" spells.

I would pick offensive spells for the Sorcerer picks, and defensive or summons for the Bard picks. Since you don't have a spell book you don't want to stuff it up at all!

Hope this helps.

Cheers.

[ October 20, 2002, 04:28: Message edited by: Khazraj ]

 

Exactly - you are absolutely right, Khazraj!

1) My B/S never had any weapon equiped - she doesn't need one

2) With the Lingering Song, she is able to sing TWO songs at a time (with that nifty script), so at lvl 5 I get +3 damage bonus per hit for all my fighters

3) I start as a Bard, and go to lvl 11 (in HoF, to lvl 5 in Normal mode) - picking utility spells like Mage Armor, Cure Spells, Cat's Grace, Invis, Emotion Hope, Improved Invis, and such - then I switch to Sorceress and pack her up with AoE spells.

She only has 1% of kills in the party, but is by far the most useful char.

Other chars feature:
1) 53 AC Svirf - Monk 1 / Thief 1 / Illusionist 6 / Cleric of Mask X - he has also a 40% multiclassing penalty, that REALLY helps my party.

2) Half-Orc Barbarian with 5 levels of Rogue and 4 levels of Fighter - he uses Polearm, and when fully buffed, he gets as much as 130 damage on a critical.

3) Cleric of Talos / Fighter - with Throwing Axe and Buff/Summon/Heal support.

Nice crew IMHO....

 

I too have been thinking about how I will deal with spellcasters and rouges in umpcoming games. I have to say I've been thinking of a bard/sorcerer and for an evil game a monk/sorcerer.

You know it's good if Modjahed gives it two powergamming thumbs up .

 

Hi, i was wondering what anybdy would think about druid/Monk or a druid/barbarian if it is even possible?

 

Modjahed, that Svirfneblin sounds awesome, gimme some of the stats!

I guess that the 40% penalty three levels above normal means that you still get lots of xp at higher level or are you being "cheeky"?

How does the game cope with so many classes? I saw on official BIO boards that the game is not really designed for more than 3 classes?...

Kudos to Modjahed. (I hope this does not start a cult!)...

 

1) The stats I will give you when I beat the game.

2) Why a big multiclass penalty helps the party? Because the exp earned from monsters is calculated based on the lowest level char you have - so while my Svirf levels up slower, the other do so faster.

I started from level 1 (HoF) and at the end of Chapter 2 everyone except the Svirf is level 23.

 

Modjahed, thanks for the info. Now I will always have a Drow or Duergar in my party!

Since I have to wait, and I will, perhaps you could send me the final battle autosave before you smash the twins? I love seeing how others played it and I might accidently export your characters....

For learning purposes only of course! LOL

Cheers.

 

Would a Bard/Sorcerer work in a 3 or 4 person party? Or is it better suited to a full 6 character party?

I only want to have a max of 4 in the party, maybe start with 2 and pick up 2 at the Goblin Fortress.

Thoughts?

 

For me it works best in a 4-person party.

Bard/Sorcerer handles all Arcane magic, then I have a Cleric (maybe Cleric/Fighter), then I have a Monk and a front line tank - damage nullifier, then a Halforc with a Polearm Weapon - 60% of kills for the party....

 

What level should you do for the bad/sorcerer? I was thinking about bard 20/sorc 10... so I can get the War chant of the Sith, and with Weimer's mod, I'll be able to use that instead of heal spells!

 

If you are playing Nomal Mode, I would suggest getting Bard level 5, then putting the rest to Sorcerer.

In HoF, I am currently doing the following: Bard to lvl 8, then Sorcerer until I get lvl 9 spells, then Bard to lvl 11, then if I have anything left, I put it to Sorcerer.

 

Big B- I see your post was quite a while ago but if it's not too late, I thought I'd tell you I played an evil monk/sorcerer and he was totally useless as both a sorcerer and a monk. By the final battle, he hadn't gotten high enough level in either to do much damage. He was the party member who got killed in every fight. My *BARD* was better in combat than he was. You might have a different experience but I didn't like it!

Unlike apparently everyone else in this thread, I like the plain old straightforward Bard. I liked the combination of spells that were available- in particular, an extra healer in the party is always helpful! I also thought the songs were very useful.

 

Take the bard, they are so good. With Lingering Song you can be so cheap!

 

I have always been a big fan of bards from the day of pen and paper D&D and rogue/fighter kits (swashbuckler comes to mind.) I praised the programers of IWD for the sub quests and replies only available for bards. In EQ *hears the groans in the backgrounds* I leveled a bard an nearly got keyboard indentations in my wrists from twisting songs (flame me all you want but "lingering song" stems directly from EQ, only those who've played will truly understand this.) Oh yeah, back to my point ... hail bards! Bards rule. I honesly never thought of bard/sorc in the past but since they compliment the other so well ... hell, I'll give it a whirl. Since all groups SHOULD have a diplomat, drop the Holy Avenger drooling false sense of being fool and tree hugging shapeshifters and pick a bard ... and maybe fiddle with a bit o' sorc in the mix. One question to Modjahed ... after leveling a bard all the way to 8 why stop there and break 9 levels into sorc before proceding to level 11 for the famed Sith song? Why not hunker down 3 more levels into bardism to hit 11 THEN switch to a sorc? Just curious ... maybe I'm missing a feat combo only obtainable my switching at that point? Thanks all for reading, L8er

 

In my experience, bard's suck. I know I probably don't use them right, since I use them as secondary fighters to protect my sorcerer, but they don't have many good spells. Sure, they're handy as back-up healers, but that's it. They've got no real attack spells, except for chromatic orb (which enemies ALWAYS save against, I haven't inflicted any damage whatsoever with chromatic orb). I don't see the point of songs, since you can't fight or spellcast and sing (unless you have lingering song, which I haven't bothered with).
However, I'd be willing to try a bard/sorcerer, since what one lacks the other has...hmm...