Guilt trip

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I come home for my dinner hour. Whilst home, some Polish dude just came to my house.

I go to the door, he hands me a card, saying

'Hello I am Polish man, who had bad car accident few year ago, I lost my speech, I need to feed my family, please can you spare me money'

Then pointed to some paintings in his bag

I said sorry mate I have no money.


What would you have done?

 

Sounds like a sponger to me mate - I'd have told him the same thing

 

I would rather give money to that guy than those bastards that collect for various charities on the highstreets. The worst part is that the collecters get paid between £8 - £12 per hous for their 'kind' work.

 

Probably what you did. Truth be told there's no way to really know whether he told you the truth or not. However it really depends on my mood at the moment (and of course whether I've got the money to spare - which is in fact not that often ); if/when I do donate something I prefer to do so through organizations where you know to whom the money goes, and what they're used for.

 

Kick him in the nads and see if he says anything?

But seriously, I'd have probably done the same as you.

 

I'm faced with a similar situation almost every day while walking between the train station and my office. I generally ignore the panhandlers - there are too may (likely apochryphal, but still...) stories about how so many of them are faking. Every now and them I might give something to someone, but there's no way I'm going to stop walking, put down my things, and go rummaging in my purse for change every time someone sticks out their hand or shakes a hat at me.

There are plenty of legitimate charities that provide genuine help to these people. Besides, a charity will give you a receipt for tax-time.

 

chev? Undertaker?

OT, 90% of the time, I don't have any spare money laying around to give to strangers. I ran into a simialr situation with a deaf mute, who handed out papers saying his condition and asking to buy a teddy bear keychain for a dollar. I do donate to the bigger named charities (Lung Association, Canadian Cancer Society) when they ring the doorbell.

Feeling guilty is normal. They want you to feel that guilt and give them money. But if you don't have any cash, what can you do?

 

You would still feel guilty if a thousand beggars came to your house each asking for a pound. If you gave the first ten of a them a pound each, the remaining ones would make you feel even more guilty for not giving them but giving the other guys. So you can't give everyone. But it's very hard to refuse when they don't even shake a pan at you but just ask you. I don't like the following situations:

• When they get some and ask for more. I realise they are desperate and it's a reasonable thing to do from their point of view and they are in no position to give much thought to the manner in which they do it. But it makes me feel bad.
• When they get more than a normal person gives the average beggar but still complain it's not much. If it weren't much for them, they wouldn't be begging, so they must know it's much. For example, my aunt gave one a 20 PLN banknote, which is 1% of the average salary here before taxes and it was probably 2% back in the time. So if the average person paid the taxes and bills and other such, he or she would have had less than 600 PLN to spend on things. So the beggar got the average person's daily upkeep worth of money (which is a statistical figure only because 90% people earned less than average back then, so it was a family's daily upkeep for many people) and still complained it was little. Homeless people nearly jump when they get 5 PLN now which is a couple of years later. Come on...

I never give when they are playing guilt trips or being arrogant. Or when they seem to need money for alcohol. Okay, I understand it's a pleasure to get a beer and a poor person shouldn't give up even dreaming of it, but I don't like the idea of living off begged money that goes on alcohol. Something is still wrong with it for me. I guess I would still buy a stranger a beer if asked in a civilised way, just not if he looks like a drunkard and alcohol seems to be part of the reason behind his current condition.

 

Well, if you liked any of the paintings, you could buy them, but just giving money to him without some sort of proof of his claim isn't something I would do. A number of scars might go a ways toward convincing me, but really I just appreciate people who are willing to go the extra mile for their scams. Self-mutilation deserves pity, IMO.

 

There is a particular avenue in our city that is popular for its shops, bars, and general atmospere. The only problem is that there are a lot of beggars there too and sometimes they can get out of hand.

I remember meeting one beggar several years ago and he told me a long sad story about how he just got into town with his young son and how his young son was sick and staying in the hospital. Could I please spare some change? I didn't have any at the time and the man made me feel uncomfortable in that undescribable way that you get gut feelings about people sometimes.

Several months ago I was back at this same avenue. I hadn't been there is a long while. It was very interesting how the same beggar approached me with the exactly same story, word for word. Although I didn't point out his mistake to him, I still didn't give him any money.

 

Ok, comming from a family that specializes in guilt trips, I would not have fallen for it.

Sure he may need money, but so do I...if he can't file for dissabilites and get free money from the government, or if he can't find a job that will accomidate his lack of speach and/or any other dissability he has, then he deserves nothing! I have no sympathy for lazy people freeloading off others.

[ January 25, 2006, 12:09: Message edited by: Kitrax ]

 

There are lots of 'citizens of the east' here begging in the streets; most of them are young-in-good-shape people that doesn't want to work, because the Generalitat (the government) gives lots opportunities for them (teaching language, giving jobs, etc.,) however, they still roam the streets asking for money, they are in the streets when the cars stop for red light and start to wash the windshield even if you don't want and they get violent if you don't give them money; few days back I came across 2 you woman (around 15 to 19) and they claimed to be deft-mute, one of them had a paper with signs and adresses and an amount of money that those signs gave: from 20 to 50€, anyone should realise that wasn't the writting of people who gave that ammount of money: bad spelling of Barcelona and street names, etc., oh, and they claimed to be from an organization that has a lotery and is very big but the paper didn't have any prove of that; of course I didn't give her money, behind me was an old lady and she didn't understand what the beggar was trying so I turned around and told her: they pretend to be deft and are asking money; the girl, who wasn't looking at me, turned to me and screamed something I didn't understand and came to me very angry; but she saw some security guys around and left running.
Yesterday, another young lady came to my door and said some sad story about her family and all of that, so I said to her that if she can do some cleaning or ironing I could give her about 20€ but she refused because she had no time.
We work hard to earn our money and we have to pay taxes and many other things that we shouldn't be paying (many taxes that we don't know what are for). These people have all the help they can get from the Generalitat (with the money WE pay in taxes) but I think that is easier to ask money for free than do a little effort (learning something and working).
I understand that in their countries the situation is bad and they may not have lots of opportunities there so they look for better places, but I can't stand people who just want to live for free without any effort. I had many sad stories too, but I always fought for earning my living.

 

In a thirld-world country like mine they're everywhere. No, don't feel guilty. I wont generalize and say that they're all lazy and don't want to work because in this country employment is a huge problem. However, I don't have the time or inclination to give money, that I don't have much of, out to every person knocking on my car window because I don't know if they'll be using it for food or to buy glue to sniff.

 

I give what I can when I can, and I don't let other people make me feel guilty -- I know in my heart that I'm generous enough with my money, and the opinions of others who are not familiar with the ins and outs of my particular financial situation do not bother me in the slightest.

 

If you're really feeling guilty about not giving to this guy, why don't you give to an even better cause? SP could always use the money...

 

I must admit that I wouldn't have given him anything either, but then I probably wouldn't have answered the door.

 

Ha! Mute polish guy going from door to door with his paintings is one of the oldest tricks in the book!

Or it could be that this same guy was actually right here in Finland back in the summer of '95, or was it '94..

Didn't give any money to him then, and I did feel guilty about it, but I was a minor then and I didn't have that much money myself! What was I supposed to do? Steal some from my mom, since she wasn't around at that exact moment?

But IMO, he was just a hoax, since those "paintings" were just glittered posters put in frames and as I recall the note he gave said that he'd painted them by himself! Or it could have been that the note just said that he was a painter...oh well...

 

I don't do business with beggars coming at my door, or collectors or whatever. I do donate to relief funds and charity occasionally, but only by bank. Too often you hear about frauds who act as collectors for charity, so i don't trust anyone. And i don't think i would trust some bum with a bag full of paintings either, probably loot from burglary.

 

Warning!
Being a Londoner, chuggers (charity muggers, FYI ) have been getting on my wick in recent years. Of late, I've taken to an aggressive stance on the subject: any charity using "hard-sell" tactics or "guilt trips" goes on my mental blacklist (currently, it consists of only Greenpeace and Help the Aged, but more may yet fall in this trap) and I won't give to them. I do this for a couple of reasons:</font>

1. I consider badgering, guilt tripping etc. (especially if they're cold-calling you on your own doorstep) as exceptionally bad form; it's the kind of thing associated with sleazy double-glazing salesmen and cowboy builders, after all. As charities, they should be above such nonsense. Granted, they need to make money to fuel their work for respective good causes, but there are issues with that I shall deal with...
2. ...here. Many of these organisations no longer go with the system of just dolling out leaflets, for you to sign up in your own time. Nooo. They want you to sign to give a certain amount per month (which involves giving bank/credit details) there an then. WTF? Surely, there's no way you can just expect people to give you that info just because you say you're from a charity. That - to me - seems dangerous, and invites scammers to copy the methodology their own ends. It is true that many people just accept the charity literature to get people "off their backs" but some folks - like me - would never sign up to anything without checking thoroughly what an organisation does first. Maybe it's because I was brought up in a home where my Mum religiously watched Watchdog every Monday, but I'm well aware that there are people out there who will try and take you for a ride, and would use any means to do so. If charities behave this way, it enables less reputable sorts to do so too. They need to consider this when thinking over strategies to increase revenue, and think more about the balance of ends and means.

/

Anyway, back to the topic, and BA's Polishman. The UK has not inconsiderable disability living allowance. If this man was legally resident here and his disability made him unable to work, he could claim it. Since this doesn't seem to be the case, I'd have him down as a sponger right away. The card could be from anywhere. The paintings could be anyone's. If he could make a living selling them, why not advertise them somewhere? If he's not scrounging then he needs business advice, not small change. If he is, then he's clearly deserving of neither your time nor your money. Sounds harsh, I know, but it's the way it goes. Especially given the lengths most businesses are forced by law to go to to accomodate disabled workers, I'd definitely not believe his story without further corrobarative evidence.

I did mention I was a bastard, right?

 

A popular guilt trip here is scouts collecting money for holidays. They occupy all cash desks in the nearby Carrefour and they pack your shopping unless you tell them not to (and before you can, anyway). I think it's a nice touch in some cases, when you're tired and all and someone does that for you, so you might be inclined to give away some change. But the service isn't normally equivalent with the money they get or would like to get. I agree, they shouldn't be made to beg. But I don't like the pretence. I just feel that vibe and I don't like it. They put you in such a situation that it looks impolite to refuse to let them pack it and outright unkind not to give them anything after they do. Okay, I realise in most cases it's not the scouts who have invented the whole thing and they don't necessarily like being there. But I still don't like it.

And how do you mean charity muggers? Some young people here ask to "borrow" or be given a specific low amount of money more or less pollitely but in such circumstances that you know you're in trouble if you don't. If they aren't determined to be nasty if you refuse, I don't mind the "borrow" thing too much, but I'm not a big fan of the phrasing. It's okay in cases like "borrowing" a piece of paper from another student or "borrowing/lending" some missing change between friends where no one normal insists on a return... perhaps I'm picky. It doesn't really matter. If that's what saves them some pride. Guess it saves *you* some pride, too, if you're being mugged.